Abortion providers face serious threats

Shame on you CNN and K. Chetry! Nice job having a baby killer supporter on your show but neglecting to bring in the other side. Typical CNN single speak. Try Fair and Balanced reporting. Chetry knows and never should have left Fox! Your Liberal view is once again on your sleeve – PATHETIC and why I would never watch your your show. Thats what it is, a show of left leaning propaganda with sinking viewership. You know full well that Lifers dont target doctors for death. Lets see, when a priest is killed, do Lifers accuse Abortionists??? NOT!

I agree, Amen. To get both sides go to Fox news. Chetry is a former anchor there. I am certainly not in favor of murder, and this killer gives pro-lifers a bad rap.
I heard about this pathetic interview from Laura Ingram. I am only on this site to scold Chetry for supporting partial-birth abortion, as she is a mother. Imagine your daughter as she is being born, then given a blow to the head causing death.

Let's see if this comment gets posted by the Communist News Network (CNN)

Thank you Ms. Derzis for telling the folks the truth about these protesters.

The people who come to reproductive health care facilities are not peaceful. They yell phrases so terrible most of us never have to experience such hatred directed our way. These folks regularly threaten lives.

Perhaps there are many reasonable folks in our world who label themselves "pro-choice." I assure you, you will not find one standing in front of a woman's health care clinic. Reasonable people do not threaten, harass, break others property and kill.

I imagine any peaceful "pro-lifer" would be terribly ashamed to see such behavior exhibited in the name of love.

This is for Marv. What do you mean that "lifers don't target doctors for death"? Surely you have heard about Dr. Barnett Slepian and his killer James Kopp.

CNN is not the party who should be ashamed here, but the people calling these doctors murderers and baby killers. They provide LIFE SAVING MEDICAL CARE to women whose pregnancies pose a grave risk to their health. Maybe your family hasn't been put in that situation, but mine has, and a late abortion was the only thing that saved my mothers life. No one particularly likes the idea of abortion, but the death of a fetus is surely preferable to the death of a 36 year-old wife and mother. My mom went on to have a healthy baby, my brother, after her abortion and we are still an intact family, one that wouldn't have existed had pro-lifers been given a say.

"Lets see, when a priest is killed, do Lifers accuse Abortionists??? NOT!"

Marv, just curious, when was the last time a pro-choicer killed a priest because the priest didn't support abortion? Now, I'm as anti-abortion as the next guy (there's no such thing as pro-abortion), but that comment was just absurdly asinine. Of course the anti-choicers don't accuse the pro-choicers, there's nothing to accuse them of.

And Kelly, bravo. You worded that perfectly.

Pro-lifers doing what they do best. Spreading hate with their license plate.

Derzis is dreadfully dishonest or ill informed, most of the protesters in front of those clinics are peaceful, if it was as she said we would have had dozens upon dozens of killings, and bombings. Of the millions of protesters at thousands of protests there is very little violence.

no such thing as pro abortion? who do you think your kidding Mike try Peter singer.

I found the following quote about the individual who shot a person at a recruiting center, ""political and religious motives" in the shooting."
Because of this he is being held as a terrorist. So should the person who shot Dr. Tiller. The late term abortions he performed had to be signed off by two physicians verifying that physicial harm would come to the mother if the procedure was not performed. They idea that anyone would ask someone to injure them selves because they don't believe in a procedure is hidious. Noone has the right to force a pregnancy in the first place. We are not a third world, backwards nation. Women have rights too.

Mike writes :"Lets see, when a priest is killed, do Lifers accuse Abortionists??? NOT!”

Not sure that makes sense. Abortionists don't paint priests as murderers or baby killers even although many of the clergymen are guilty of horrific pedophilia and child abuse - much of which has been swept under the rug by the church. Yes, there are pro-lifers who are not violent but many of the organizations that exist today are flirting with violent extremism and undermining their own message of love and compassion.

Marv/Ellen, The other side showed they are not "pro life" and got there side in by murdering a doctor. You can watch fox news and hear what you want to here or you can watch CNN and hear the truth. You are going to have to deal with eventually might as well be now. I love how you right wingers are pro life as long as they are soldiers or abortion docs. Also you are anti big government unless except when the government tries to interveen in the personal lives of citizens. You can legislate morality......If you can learn that.

Operation Rescue is a domestic terrorist organization support by Fox News. Dr. Killer was murdered in cold blood and the killer, Bill O'Reilly and the senior staffers of Operation Rescue should all put jailed for murder. Dr. Tiller was doing his job. Abortion is legal in the U.S. Shame on CNN for contributing to the controversy surrounding abortion by espousing right-wing rhetoric. Abortion is legal. Dr. Tiller did nothing wrong by law.

Anti-choicers have the awkward task of condemning murder and celebrating the end of an abortion doctor. What do these anti-choice groups mean when they say they are not responsible for the murder of Dr. Tiller? They only called Dr. Tiller a mass murderer, encouraged his harassment, supported numerous attacks on his clinic, and fueled vigilantism on their websites. Christian love indeed.

For the life of me I can’t understand the mentally of baby murderers!

George Tiller supposedly is a man of faith and is an active Christian in his church; but yet on the other had he kills the unborn! One of God’s commandment is ‘Thou shall not kill’. I just can’t seem to understand the logic in this! From what I’ve been taught the Ten Commandments are non-negotiable or is there a hidden revelation in the Bible that we don’t know of that give ‘homicidal doctors’ a mandate to stop God from bringing into the world new creation?
Tiller "dedicated his life to providing women with high-quality heath care despite frequent threats and violence," his family said…. Since when is it unhealthy to have children?

The martyrdom of innocent babies in the 20th. Century is the worst holocaust in human history!

Call them what they are, they are TERRORISTS!

The FBI defines terrorism as:

The unlawful use of force or violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a Government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives.

Thats what these people are.. Stop dancing around this, stop calling it violence or threats. They are terrorists and should be treated as such

Lets see ultra religious fanatics that threaten, terrorize and kill civilians to try and achieve misguided goals.....Reminds me of something....oh yeah Al Quieda. This is a terrorist act that should be treated that way. This isn't peaceful protest that is protected by the first amendment it is terrorism.

I am pro-life. Murder is an outrage. The murder of this abortion provider is evil. The person who did it has committed a grave mortal sin – an abhorrent twisted sick evil thing. DO NOT CONFUSE this sick twisted act for some kind of representation of the pro-life movement. The real pro-life movement takes place at church, where people pray for children and their mothers and the abortion providers; at home where parents educate and prepare their children for loving relationships; at school, where teachers teach that sex is a loving exchange in a loving marriage where the purpose is to have children, not to just have sex to satisfy the passions; in quiet, peaceful organized protests and demostrations, not in a bullhorn shouting, dismembered fetus poster holding, ridiculous screaming nutcase display...that helps nothing. The real pro-life movement makes an effort to build a support network for mothers in crisis. They offer help for those in need. PEOPLE WHO MURDER ARE MURDERERS AND THEY ARE NOT PRO-LIFE. THEY ARE PRO-MURDER. Do not confuse the two.

Abort a fetus or kill an unborn baby. What's the difference? Pro-Choice groups use the politically correct term while Pro-Lifers call it what it is. Any loss of life, including Dr. Tiller's, is a tragedy. A crime was committed. Now it's up to the criminal justice system to prosecute this guy to the fullest extent of the law. Perhaps during her next interview, Ms. Chetry can show a viedo of a late term abortion so her viewers can gain a better understanding of what she's talking about.

God Bless Dr. Tiller

He died defending women's rights. My condolences to his family.
He was obviously an honourable man who cared a bout women.
No one can kill someone and call themselves pro-life. The murderer is obviously just insane.

God bless Scott – he elimiated a Hitler for profit

The extreme right incited this terrible behaviour and they forever have blood on their hands. If we can't stop domestic terrorism, how in the world can we conquer international terrorism. Marv and Ellen who responded to this article are wing nuts. Go to church and say a prayer for yourself. The rest of the country doesn't need your hypocrisy. You are encouraging religious jihad.

Terrible. No reason for this. But ask yourself this question, if you are a DOCTOR, and your whole life is about abortion, then you are such a bad doctor it doesnt matter. no one should be murdered, but maybe he \should have been a vet and had PETA raining on his parade!!!!!

Holly, please clarify...why would a "pro-choice" person stand outside of a clinic and protest (paragraph 3)? And don't "pro-choice" people kill?

Pro-lifers have every right to stand outside of these clinics and protest as freedom of speech grants us this right. I for one understand the hardships many women in this country face especially the fear and distress of an unplanned pregnancy. But there are alternate solutions out there like the thousands of families waiting to adopt a child because they are unable to conceive. I bet you if every woman that walked into a clinic had an ultrasound performed at least 50% would have a change of heart. There is no greater gift than the gift of life.

A Few Thoughts...

1) Abortion is a necessary thing in society. Without it, we would return to the days before the decision of Roe V Wade when abortion was done in back alleys and women died because of botched procedures. With it legal, it can be regulated and kept safe. If abortion is ruled illegal, even more will die that there were with abortion.
2) Sometimes an abortion is necessary. There are too many variables to make a blanket statement that all abortion is unnecessary.
3) You can't be pro-life, support war, and kill doctors. (most republicans are the first two- a contradiction)
4) Marv and Ellen- You watch Fox News for fair and balanced coverage? What Fox are you watching. I have never seen a more biased news source. (Except for Stephen Colbert who is about as legitamate of a news source as Fox).
5) I say these things as a Pro-Choice, Democratic, Catholic, Jesuit Educated (Yes JESUIT educated- an order of the Catholic Church) youth. I am a direct counterexample to those of you who claim you can't be pro-choice and catholic

helping women? derzis how are you helping women? By disposing of an inconvienient human? a late term fetus is as human as you get hiney...Your generalization of protestors is down right disgusting...to state that the prolife organization are lying by apoligizing shows your low level of integrity you won't even accept a heartfelt sorry for a finatical psyco taking someones life...cnn this is a terrible excuse for news and you should seriously rethink this propoganda

Kelly,

I'm sorry to hear you're proud of your mother for your would be sibiling's termination. I would also love to hear what the medical circumstances were that caused your mother to believe the pregnancy put her life in danger since there isn't one such case on record with the AMA.

Mike, you know as well as anybody that those against abortion are no more "anti-choice" than those that support it are "anti-life". Why the wordplay?

I think the most telling comment by this baby killer is "We love what we do." So much for justifying abortion as a necessary evil. The PC approach is – if contraception is more easily available, then we wouldn't need to do what we do. This bitch says that she LOVES killing babies. Mike, Kelly, you are wrong. She is obviously pro abortion. And Derzis is a pathetic excuse for a human being.

A prolifer loosing his control and murdering an abortion doctor differs from planned murder that are conducted every day- in dozens-in the so called abortion clinics. Those clinics do not value life at all. Human beings and their bodies are business items for them.
Do these clinics supply embryonic stem cells for research after having aborted them?

You know what CNN, this piece is ridiculous. Sure, I don't agree with abortion, I'd like to see an end to it, but I also respect all life, including the lives of the abortion providers. I stand in front of clinics and pray. I'm friends with protesters and every protester I know condemns the murder of Dr Tiller. Shame on you, CNN, for such a biased and unbalanced presentation of this issue.

Thank you CNN for showing the dangers that these men and women face every day. Without these wonderful doctors, nurses, and other employees, many women would not have life saving options.

Four abortion providers have been aproximatley 9 abortion clinic employees killed in sixteen years. Each one was a shame, and I hope the people who commited the murders get life or the death penalty. However this is hardley the epidemic or the plauge that CNN tries to make it out to be.

Any needless loss of life is a tragedy and that goes for both sides of the argument. I am just waiting to see the media hysteria this brings about and how little it will have to do with true statistics.

June 1981. Found out birthcontrol failed. 17 years old. Year of high school left. Boyfriend in and out of college. She not ready to be a parent, he not ready to settle down. Couldn't ruin three lives. That 17 year old made her choice and made the right choice for her at that time and will never regret it. This 45 year old sad she never had children. Will fight to make sure every 17 year old has that same choice.

Throughout history, right up to the present time, (Bush and Iraq for example) religious zealots have killed innocent dissenters, owners of coveted properties, or merely the different, on a massive scale, but used some God's name to somehow justify it to themselves, and especially to influence others to do their filthy evil work.

On the other hand, I can't recall any massacre, even on a small scale, caused by a brotherhood of Doctors.

Organized religion, it's outrageous lies and most pious and hence irrational supporters, are the truest and greatest source of evil in this World. Even Jesus was deliberately killed by the Pharisees for preaching tolerance and non-violence.

Wow, fox news viewership is even more psychotic and desperate than I imagined. Talk about terrorist sympathizers!

"Pro-Life" terrorist organizations need to be treated like islamist terrorist groups. Let's end the hypocrisy if we're still going to wage a so-called war against terror.

Ellen–You are obviously delusional. Rupert Murdoch, owner of Fox said "We've never been an organization to be bothered with facts." Fox, the voice of the Repugnant party has only one side, their side and it isn't based on any facts other than the ones they make up. Anti-abortion nutbags like this guy are no better than Timothy McVeigh, Terry Nichols or Osama Bin Laden and should have the same label–TERRORISTS!

Hey folks,

Yes Tiller was a rare breed of an abortionist. He killed unborn children that were viable and in the 3rd trimester. But make not mistake many hundreds of abortion clinics and medical hospitals perform late term abortions if you define late term as after 16 weeks pregnancy. They are hundreds of facilities in every major city in the land that advertise in the yellow pages and on the internet that feature that they do abortions through 24 weeks. yes 24 weeks people. not 3rd trimester but is characterized as late term on their websites nonetheless.
Imagine a medical doctor aborting an unborn child at 20-24 weeks by mutilation and dismemberment. Sometimes the fetus is given a lethal injection before dismemberment and sometimes not. Imagine the pain of the unborn child with this horrific procedure. And sometimes the doctor elects to prematurely birth the unborn child but he firsts gives it a lethal injection in the womb to kill it. Surely they don't want a living fetus being ejected out whole by mistake if the object is to have a dead unborn child aborted.

"Pro Lifer's don't target doctors". If my doctor hadn't been murdered by lies I would believe it.

Dr. Tiller did not preform partial birth abortions. Women who seek late term abortions do not have 'viable' babies.

How do I know? Dr. Tiller preformed my late term abortion (not partial birth abortion). I was 6 1/2 months pregnant and my son was profoundly ill (not an inconvenience but *profoundly* ill).

I saw everything that man did to me and my son. At no time did my son feel any pain and was delivered whole. Dr. Tiller gave my precious child a painless and dignified death. That man treated me with compassion and respect. Which is more that I can say about his detractors.

Anyone who compared Dr. Tiller to Hilter has blood on their hands. Anyone who told people he preformed partial birth abortions has blood on their hands. And anyone who says they don't support murder of these doctors but understand it is a hypocrite.

God bless Dr. Tiller for helping me and my son.

It really makes you wonder what Christ would think of these protesters in front of abortion clinics, making a political statement, or worse, making threats against, humiliating, and harassing those most in need of love and support. Let alone picking up a weapon and killing them.

Anyone out there waving signs and screaming a message of hate is not doing it in the name of any high religious principle. God would be ashamed of these people, all of whom have a little blood on their hands.

Op Rescue, Christian Defense Coalition and all the rest of the anti abortion organizations that produce inflammatory slogans, posters, and rhetoric are simply enabling the Scott Roeder's of the world to go out and do the killing while the so-called leaders of these groups sit back and tut-tut the consequences. These pernicious and constant campaigns don't solve the problems of unwanted pregnancy or abortion. These groups set up the fuel and wait for an unstable personality to touch it off. They are as culpable as their proxies in these murders.

Now should this be considered as hate crime or terrorist activation?

This is the typical face of fundamentalism. The political use of abortion has lead to this. This has to stop.

This cold blooded murder along with all the other bombings and terrorist activites by these right wing fundamentalist christians (christian in name only). In there mind, the christian teachings of peace, forgivness and brotherhood only apply so long as you follow their way of life. Now they can wring their hands and say "oh how terrible, we certainly don't condone such violence" all the while continuing their intimidating and terrorising of any clinic they don't agree with.

I dont agree with the killing of this man, but if these abortion clinics have the right to take hundreds of lives per day (for selfish reasons) and never face justice, then why should this man be punished. It's only common sense. Killing is wrong no matter who it is. Yes, a fetus is a who. For all those who are in support of abortions, you should be forced to see for yourself what happens. I have seen for myself. I used to work in one. It is a sad thing when you have to hold the hand of a dying baby, or have to be present in the midst of a murder of someone who has no voice.

Ah, yes. Eric Rudolph, who referred to the TV as "the electric Jew."

Bravo to the brave people who defend reproductive rights every day and who make them accessible and SAFE: from the doctors to the escorts to those who donate their money. Thank you, and please don't let this stop you. You are needed and appreciated!

Derzis: You know, you can’t meet and talk with the women that we see on a daily basis and not know that what you’re doing is right and moral…And Dr. Tiller, the women he saw…he was the last resort. These were women who had wanted to be pregnant, who valued their pregnancies and for whatever reason were forced to terminate. And I think that’s the important thing is we know what kind of a role we place in the community…no one would choose to do this for a job. It’s a calling.

Um, I didn't want to be pregnant, I didn't value it, and was not forced to terminate, I chose to terminate. I wasn't ready for a child and now I live with the regret that I should've given my baby up for adoption, but I was too selfish to do that. I do think abortion is wrong, but believe that a woman has a right to chose what to do with her own body. I think there are few cases where the woman wants to be pregnant but has to terminate because of the pregnancy being harmful to her or the baby has a birth defect. The majority of abortions are due to women not using birth control and having an abortion is their birth control. To limit the number of abortions, there needs to be more education on birth control.

The pro-life movement just doesn’t get it. They are correct that most people in the USA are against abortion. But what they are for is the right of a person to choose. The pro-life or pro-choice is NOT about abortion it is about the RIGHT to choose. We are only human and no one has the right to tell another human in this country how to live their lives in this country. The people who choose to have an abortion, only God should be allowed to judge them not man. God’s wraith is His wraith and only His. Why are there groups outside of abortion clinic spewing hate, non-compassion and no forgiveness?
Do you really think we can stop unwanted pregnancies? Isn’t being a Christian about forgiveness, love and compassion?
Aren’t the right wing religious folks against contraceptives? Even the Pope has changed the churches rules away from the “rhythm method” and updated a 400-year-old rule to more reflect a world of today.
Maybe most of the right wing religious people should go live in Saudi Arabia, that country is more in tune with your beliefs. If you go you better have no sin…. If you do you might loose some body parts there. Ain’t free will a bi tch!

I saw Dr Warren Hearn's appearance on CNN. I was appalled. I worked as a counselor in his clinic. Dr. Hearn entered the abortion field because it is lucritive, not because he is a advocate of women. Working in his clinic, he was abusive to staff (all women), into power and control, the women were codependent to his mood swings. he once told a women in the surgical procedure room (my client) to stop crying or he wouldn't perform the abortion and she might die. Another women who was moving in pain, he threw down the instruments and stormed out of the room saying that she was fully dialated and could go home and have the baby. One woman I counseled elected the abortion because her boyfriend didn't want a baby and she couldn't get him to change his mind even as the child developed into the 3rd trimester. I saw the fetus delivered. I was shocked and I almost changed my mind about late trimester abortions. There were more elective 3rd timester that this one. Dr. Hearn's agenda is not pure. he also loves the limelight and being a victim.

I saw Dr Warren Hearn’s appearance on CNN. I was appalled. I worked as a counselor in his clinic where he treated patients and staff abusively. Dr. Hearn was into power and control. He spoke to people abusively. . Dr. Hearn entered the abortion field because it is lucritive, not because he is a advocate of women. Working in his clinic, he was abusive to staff (all women), into power and control, the women were codependent to his mood swings. he once told a women in the surgical procedure room (my client) to stop crying or he wouldn’t perform the abortion and she might die. Another women who was moving in pain, he threw down the instruments and stormed out of the room saying that she was fully dialated and could go home and have the baby. One woman I counseled elected the abortion because her boyfriend didn’t want a baby and she couldn’t get him to change his mind even as the child developed into the 3rd trimester. I saw the fetus delivered. I was shocked and I almost changed my mind about late trimester abortions. There were more elective 3rd timester that this one. Dr. Hearn’s agenda is not pure. he also loves the limelight and being a victim.

I am a "peaceful pro-lifer" and i find this event appauling. I do not appreaciate being put in the same catagory as a men who commit murder in a churches or bomb abortion clinics. This is not the message the pro-life campaigners want to portray. In fact most prolifers agree with abortion incases of mental and physical health of the mother including late term abortions. I will agree with Marv in that the other side should have had the chance to have there say... it's only fair. I applaud doctors who are in the abortion business to save lives but i am appauled at those who do it as a means of making money...

Just wondering how many of you that are so against abortion have adopted crack babies, babies with birth-defects, babies that are severely retarded, etc. It is a sad state of affairs that men can get women pregnant and yet, take no responsibility for their actions.

Although I do not condone abortion, I can see where this would be a viable option for a young mother of three who really and truly can't afford another child. I support abstinence; however, is that realistic? No. This is just my opinion and we all know what they say about opinions....

Holly,

While I agree murder and death threats are uncalled for, why should protesters NOT harass? pro lifers protest abortion because they believe it is the killing of human babies that just happen to not have gone through the birthing process yet.

Were not talking about people people protesting in front of mcdonald's because their portion sizes are too large. The unjust taking of human life is the most serious crime in our society. If thats not reason to get fired up about something then what is?

I am absolutely 100% against murder. Which is why I am against abortion. That doctor should not have been gunned down. He has every right to life even though he has taken a countless number of innocent ones. I do NOT support civilians taking the law into their own hands. But I had to laugh when that pathetic excuse for a doctor directed all blame to pro-lifers. Who is he to speak on violence when his own profession relies on it? Who is he to point the finger at those of us who have every right to our views? Because we do not agree, we are all murderers? Why would CNN allow such ludicrous testimony? Of course it's typical which is why I take their news with a grain of salt. I am proud to stand up for unborn babies. I will not be bullied by a bunch of hypocrites with a guilty conscience. Why is murder ok when it's for convenience? Give me a break and grow a conscience while you are at it.

If you're pro life, don't get an abortion. But don't try and tell others what to do with their lives. You people are completely nuts!!!!!!!

How can anti-abortionists be so gung ho on killing a doctor. You call yourselves Christians, but it's okay to kill a person. I don't get it. You guys have your facts all wrong.

I Used Dr. Tillers Clinic For A Late Term Abortion. All you commentators do not have a clue of the emotional pain a pregnant women has to go thru to have an abortion. I had to abort my 26 weeks old fetus due to severe deformity and birth defects. My OBGYN recommended me to Dr. Tiller's clinic as even they understood, we should not give birth as the "life" the child will have ...will be painful to watch and very limiting for the child. The abortion is conducted in a safe, sensitive and clinically first rate procedure. The very latest scientific techniques & drugs are used to induce fetus “sleep”. After the abortion, I was given an option to 'meet' my baby boy, which my husband and I gladly did. The baby was given to us in a beautiful and sensitive manner and we both said our silent goodbye's to him. After which the clinic Chaplain performed appropriate last rites. Portions of the media, anti-abortion groups and their RELIGIOUS lobbies have portrayed Dr. Tiller and similar clinics as amoral slaughterhouses. My reality is this – Dr. Tiller’s clinic is a refuge of last resort for families in a difficult predicament. No one has a right to decide on abortion other than Mother and her doctor. Abortion is a emotionally tough choice for a pregnant woman, in the least, PLEASE don’t judge her or her doctor!

It's time that the tables are turned and people start taking out these zelots who kill anyone who doesn't believe the way think they should. It is every doctors right to perform abortions and also it is within the law. Women do have rights and it's our bodies not yours

Anyone who has ever held a sign accusing doctors of being baby killers is partially responsible for this crime. There are plenty of us pro-choicers who absolutely understand your position because we too are opposed to violence and killing. But your hypocrisy and narrow minded agenda and humans-riding-dinosaurs-museums quit being funny and strange when you cross these lines. You want to be pro-life? Try going vegetarian, even for a day. A pig/cow/chicken/dog/mouse is infinitely more capable of feeling pain and suffering than a two-week old human fetus. Try demonstrating against capital punishment. Try demonstrating against global warming, which is causing children to die by the thousands in third world countries. Try for a second (and I know it's hard) NOT to congratulate our brave soldiers for returning from a war that has killed thousands more. The second you people start truly being pro-life across the board and not just because of some narrow-minded religious viewpoint that carries little scientific validity, maybe -and just maybe – your opinions will be worth something.

Although the anti-abortion crowd characterizes itself as chest-thumping self-righteous and self-proclaimed moral guardians, these are some of the most absolutely twisted, immoral people I have ever encountered. There is nothing in the bible that directly addresses abortion, and abortion existed long before jesus. There is no basis, other than cult-religion doctrine, to assume that early-stage embryos are human beings, and, were that the case, then the christian deity would be the greatest abortionist of all, since an extremely large fraction of embryos are spontaneously aborted – probably as a result of generttic defects. These are people who would vote for, ans support, mass murderers of fully developed, talking and thinking human beings given that mass murderer supports their position. No true conservative would ever support government interefrence in such private decisions.

Did CNN really moderate Marv? Kudos to Kelly and Mike. And Ellen you don't get both sides by watching CNN and Fox you get the Middle and the Right end of the political spectrum!

It does not surprise me that 50 percent of America is pro-choice; ie;
baby killers. Remember, a hundred and sixty years ago 50 percent of America believed that slavery was not morally wrong. We now know that slavery is a moral evil. Will it take another hundred and sixty years to realize that abortion is morally evil and murder? It's to bad people like Diane Derzis are ignorant just like the people who supported slavery in the past.

Personally, I think that eveyone needs to mind their own business. It's a woman's choice, and it is between her, her conscious, and her God.

None of these people have a heaven or hell to put anyone in, and they are not doing the will of God because if they were then they would follow the scriptures. God said "vengance is mine, and I shall repay" not these people here. All these kinds of action will tale us back to the 50s & 60s when women went to the quacks, and flew overseas to handle their affairs. Mind you OWN business, and leave everyone's elses along.

"To get both sides go to Fox News?" That's the most laughable sentence on this entire message board.

You're right Marv; CNN IS being awfully one sided in this debate. So let's hear the side of the story from people who support killing doctors.

Here's a newsflash you won't see on Faux News: reality doesn't HAVE two sides to it. It just is. Anti-abortionists are the ones who tend to go homicidal and kill people. Us "lefties" are the ones who try to employ REASON when dealing with you people. So yeah, if the shoe fits...

I was a patient of Dr. Tillers.

There are many stereotypes and misconceptions about his late term abortion services. The late term services he offered were for women who had very poor fetal prognosis, babies with anomalies. Saying these babies were viable is misleading. Most of the late term procedures were done for babies with illnesses that were not conducive to life. The few infants that would have survived delivery would have had drastically shortened lives filled with numerous surgeries and endless suffering. The week I had my procedure there was a woman whose baby had it’s internal organs developed outside of it’s body. Another womans baby had no brain. There was never any hope for those babies there was no miracle that would have saved them.

I was forced to make an agonizing choice for a baby my husband and I wanted and loved very much. This was NOT a form of birth control. I chose the lesser of the evils and did what any loving parent should, eased the suffering of an innocent baby. Forcing my baby to live would have been cruel. That was a deeply personal decision and one I will gladly sort out with my maker in the hereafter. I would gladly offer my soul to protect my child.

I do not take pride in what I was forced to do but I carry no shame. In a perfect world my baby would have come home to a family that wanted them very much. It was not a situation I took lightly. I will also mourn this loss the remainder of my life.

Dr. Tiller was the only doctor who accepted my particular case due to my own physical complications. Dr. Tiller is my hero, he not only saved my life but saved my family. I was fully prepared to end my own life to protect my baby from a life of misery. Dr. Tiller offered a service that although much despised is also critical in a civilized society.

The man who shot him is a coward. He ran away like a thief in the night, too afraid to stand tall for his principles. Dr. Tiller was a man who stood up for what he believed in without fear. I will never forget him or the profound impact he made on myself and my family for the rest of our lives.

If you can’t understand that I suggest you watch a baby cry out in pain for several months and then watch their miniature coffin be laid to rest in front of permanently scarred parents. Maybe then you will understand…

First of all abortion is wrong...yes... it is but it is necessary!. Many women don't need to have children, they simply dont want them, there are also women who were raped, are victims of incest etc. The mere fact that someone took the life of this man for whatever reason in a CHURCH is beyond being an activist, it is being a terrorist! I am pro-choice, because at the end of the day it is the person's choice to do whatever they want, however when we die I believe we have to pay for all the things we done. This doctor was there for women, when they needed someone the most, and he is gone. For what! Doing a service to the women and the community . I say community because if these women could not support these children or whatever the case may be...what happens to the children after. Some may get adopted some may get put into foster care and become a child of the state...how many happy stories have you heard from children in foster care?! Whatever side you choose, be it PRO-LIFE or PRO-CHOICE killing to get your point across is just plain STUPID. Now I want to take the time out to say I am so sorry to the Family of Dr. Tiller and may the lord bless them through this difficult time. I respect Dr. Tiller because he did a job that was needed, however it was viewed it was a needed job and he did it well. And to the killer...who if he was PRO-LIFE, took a life (in a church) I wanna say you are no longer a PRO-LIFE person you are PRO-CHOICE, because you choose to kill this man. How PRO-LIFE are you?!

I certainly am losing no sleep over the murder of the doctor, as I wouldn't condone this, but I can't help seeing some true irony in people who SUPPORT the killing of babies who cannot possibly defend themselves, versus the killing of a doctor who kills babies.... Seriously, how can anyone condemn a man for murdering a man that murders babies? Seriously, for one single moment, the doctor who was killed KILLED babies for a living!

How have things gone so awry in this world that baby killers are defended by the news media?

You know, the anti-choicers have been thugs and vigilantes from the beginning. They have no choice but to kill those they don't agree with, given our laws allow abortion and the voters (see Colorado Amendment 48 for example) clearly prove themselves smart enough to know an zygote/embryo/fetus is not a person.

And quite frankly, the blood libel claims (calling those they don't agree with 'baby killers', etc) harken back to the days of 700 AD. The fact is, abortion is not murder, no matter the opinions of the anti-choice thugs, in the same way the Jehovah Witnesses have no legal right whatsoever to kill whoever is in favor of blood transfusions.

The anti-choicers seriously need to wake the fock up and realize their pet religious fantasies have no place whatsoever in our laws.

CNN continues to show this one side. I know for a fact many people that stand outside abortion clinics- very peacefully. They do have an agenda, and it is to reduce abortions. We do believe it's about life, not about choice. A hand, a mind, a beating heart, eyes that are formed, that with a knife is killed all for the sake of free choice. This is not a calling, this is about aggressive acts of violence that we call pro-choice. We also don't have any agendas that address hurting or injuring doctors, patience, nurses, or anyone tied to this program. There are many christians that pray outside these clinics only to share options that most clinics don't share, share about pregnancy centers that pay and support these women that the abortion centers don't share about, and offer these women hope that is not shared with abortion centers. When people realize that Diane Derzis supports a multi-million dollar industry, and her calling is not of christian faith but one of death to unborn children called pro-choice, we then realize her calling. This act on the doctor is a sad day, as we that fight for life for children, for the elderly, and for the sinner. Isn't it unique that Jesus's own comments is on the innocense of children, and this world today battles the life and death of the unborn. I feel sorry for the mothers that Kelly references, as we don't have an answer for those unique situations, and we understand that delima, it's a life both ways. Which do we choose-that is a true choice that must be considered? However, Diane is not addressing those situations, she wants unlimited, unopposed, uneducated abortions to children that already listen to music, listen to our hearts, listen to our voice, and listen to our prayers. Those that stand at many abortion clinics silently pray for the mothers, and the children whose lives will change when the act is over. That is an area that Diane can't address as many ladies that have had abortions stand outside these clinics, not with guns nor hatred, but of compassion for the loss of a soul, and the loss that all mothers feel after the fact. The body and the heart knows. The questions setup by Chetry, were direct and intended to pull exactly what she wanted. She had no defense, but one only to pull out the extreme stance to try to say that pro-life teams are violent. If you only new Chetry, if you only knew. The hatred comes from your questions, and the idea that people fight with prayer on the life of children only acknowldges your heart as cold as it is, struggles with each peaceful position. Your heart is distant from it's source. Kelly we pray for you mother, as she really had a hard choice, and I'm sure she thinks about her loss more than we know. God's peace to all.

The inflammatory rhetoric from Randal Terry et al makes it very easy for these cold blooded murderers to justify their actions. It is easy for Randal Terry after this murder to condemm the violence but he is as guilty as Scott Roeder. As Obama says you cannot have dialogue with all this hatred that is spoken of with regards to a woman`s right to choose. As Mike says : there are no pro-abortionists" but woman must control their own bodies and it is the religious fanatics (all male) who are the perpatrators of this hatred and violence.

I think it's important to keep in mind this comment that she made, "These were women who had wanted to be pregnant, who valued their pregnancies and for whatever reason were forced to terminate." Dr. Tiller performed an invaluable service to grieving mothers who were places in a desperate position with wanted pregnancies that had severe medical issues. It's not a position I would ever want to be in but it was comforting to know that Dr. Tiller was there for those women who needed him. His death is a huge loss for the women in this world.

to kelly and mike: i love it how you people keep on bringing up "mother's health and birth defects" excuse when those are only like what ? 5-10% of the abortions. 80-95% of these horrific abortions were elective, meaning no rape, no incest, no health problems, nothing was wrong! meaning Absolutely no reason to have an abortion! Okay, so just shut the hell up and stop bringing these dumb excuses to legalize these murders. And why do you have to wait that late to have an abortion anyways?? that's freakin murder because by then baby is already kicking, moving, and beating. It's a living being!

Whatever happened to presenting both sides of an issue? I guess we know where you stand on abortion.

"But the people by and large who stand in front of these clinics every day have their own agenda and that agenda is to do away with abortion in whatever way they can."

You let this abortionist get away with calling all pro-lifers murderers.

The fact is no prominent pro life or Christian organization supports killing abortion doctors.

CNN would NEVER report it, but Ronald Fitzsimmons of NARAL has admiited that a majority of late term abortions are on Healthy babies and Tiller himself did many elective abortions on Healthy babies.CNN also would never report thatPro choice violence exists too. Pro lifers have been targeted and killed by abortion doctors and activists. There is an entire website called abortionviolence dedicated to the violence and intolerance shown by pro abortion rights activists. I was recently at the March for Life in Ottawa, Canada and brought 50 students with me who signed up to go from the high school I teach at. Pro choice counter protesters almost attacked my students, screaming in their faces and threatening to harm them before running away and targeted other teens screaming " i had an abortion do you want to beat me up?? Come on..fight me!!" Meanwhile 12,000 pro lifers marched peacefully to parliament hill to hear women who had had abortions talk about why they are pro life now.

Fox news now has both sides of the story? When did this start?

PEOPLE STOP USING RELIGION AS A CRUTCH!!! just BECAUSE SOMEONE DOSENT BELIEVE IN YOUR BIBLE AND HOW YOU INTERPRET YOU USE HARSH WORDS TO TRY AND HUMILIATE..

How so for you bible tossers WWJD? Stop being so hypocritical if you dont believe in abortion you dont do it.. the bible is a book of interpretations!!! THERE IS NO SPECIFIC verbage against abortions, and NO! DONT USE THAT FAMOUS COMMANDMENT AS A CRUTCH! THE BIBLE DOSENT SPECIFICALLY SAY A FETUS IS A LIFE!

AND IF IT DID THE BIBLE WAS MADE BY MAN, STUDY HOW YOUR BIBLE CAME INTO CREATION AND STOP BEING SO JUDGEMENTAL!

IF GOD SAYS IT IS WRONG LET HIM BE THE JUDGE NOT A SINFUL MAN!!

Actually, Mike, I'm pro-abortion. It's none of my business what another woman decides to do with her body. Especially if she has been raped or is incapable of taking care of a baby and cannot give it up for adoption. I agree, no one WANTS to have an abortion, but to say that no one IS pro-abortion is just wrong. Let's work on things to keep abortion to a minimum – like sex education for youngsters and harsher criminal punishment for rapists.

As President Obama implies "can't we all get along" with our differing views on abortion? As long as abortion is legal in the United States and there is an explanation for the need for abortion (that each case represents a separate and considered decision) then abortion can be performed. It is not ethical to attack the legal providers to change the system. There are legislative and legal ways to make the change and if the consensus of society agrees that elective abortion should never occur, change the law, don't incite killing doctors. ..Maurice.
http://bioethicsdiscussion.blogspot.com

These religious freaks are just as bad as hardline Islamic terrorists.

I think the Pro-life Activists need to find something else to focus on. It is creepy. What does a 51 year old man really have to say about what a woman does with her body? Why is he a self-proclaimed savior of fetuses....? In almost every violent crime against abortion providers it is some deranged, middle-aged wing-nut who does the deed. Pro-lifers, makes you look pretty creepy. Get a new hobby.

i had an abortion over two years ago, and it was the best decision i have made in my life, before my career in social work i never knew how many kids where put up for adoption and ultimately end up in a foster system that fails them hundreds, thousands of them..so where are the prolifers that support this? do any of them adopt the kids NOPE! i had an abortion and i ultimately know that i would no t have achieved things that i wanted in life with a c hild. Children can be burdens! especially to women, men dont carry the children like us nor raise them, WE DO. MEN just want another way to control us and it begins with our bodies, stop using religion and not rationality to justify your actions, ABRAHAM SACRIFICED ISAAC IN THE BIBLE WAS THAT RATIONAL?

This woman is a liar. The protestors in front of the clinics dont call for the killing of abortion providers.
That is simply not true. They sing and pray and hope it will end, but they dont call for homocide.

Abortion in ANY term, late or not is MURDER of an innocent unborn child. Dr. Tiller didn't believe this. He fought for what he believed in. He knew the risk. He lost.

"To get both sides go to Fox news."

And you immediately discredit anything you say after this. I don't like CNN particularly, but you're making it sound like Fox News is the end-all be-all for balanced reporting. Try again.

Waa, waa, waa. Wow the lefty loonies can make a bloody murder sound so good. It's life saving medical care. It was there last choice. Blah blah blah. Dr Tiller got what was coming to him people. Wake up. You stab a precious baby through the skull and suck his brains out, a baby that's literally seconds from you holding him/her in your arms and sucking nutritious milk from his/her mother's breast; you stab it through the skull, suck it's brains out and throw it in a bloody trash can like used coffee grounds and see how far you get in life. See how long God keeps His hand of protection on you when you burn a baby alive with acid, or suck it from it's mother's created womb until it's arms and legs are torn from it's torso. It's amazing that all people that support abortion are already born....you pathetic, blind, cowards. Mike, of course there is pro-abortion. If there wasn't, abortion wouldn't be legal. You reap what you sow people. You reap what you sow. And facts are facts. Majority of abortions are done because the baby would inconvenience the life of the mother or father. Not right timing, not enough money, blah, blah, blah.

Pro Life terrorists. This a woman's issue. Her body. Her choice. Many pro life terrorist want to hurt and kill just as they yell and scream at women in front of health care facilites. PROLIFE....for who? Who are they to judge? Again, This is a personal woman's issue between her doctor and whom ever she prays to and medical care should be the hallmark of a civilized country.
This coward who shot Dr. Tiller should get the death penalty. Instead he will go to jail and we the people will have to pay to lock him up until he does die. Is this justice? for who?
Women will continue to seek health care for themselves and their choices and if we deny them health care then its back to back room coat hangers and women will die. I'm sure the prolifer like that idea. They want to force women into their narrow and small minded world. Force them to bear a child or die trying. Sounds like a third world religious extremist world that NO American woman should have to live with. For that matter NO WOMAN on earth.

Late Term Abortions don't save lives. They take them. A mother faced with a need to deliver can opt for a C-Section.

Getting an abortion for the safety of the mother is a lie. There are other options. If not, their would be hundreds of these people doing late term abortions instead of a handful.

First of all, there is no such thing as an "abortion doctor" as is being reported. The correct term is "gynecologist". Secondly, Dr. Tiller wasn't murdered, he was assassinated. This was an act of domestic terrorism, plain and simple. Rhetoric from Republican leaders such as Limbaugh, O'Reilly, etc. about abortion has done nothing but incite violence.

Surely, if the "party of life" was as committed as they said, they would have done *something* to act on their convictions during the six years they completely controlled Congress and the White House.

Finally, shame on the media for implying that the abortions doctor Tiller performed were somehow "routine" and just women who wanted to get rid of their babies. There were very few late term abortions, and most were for things such as children who did not have a heart, mothers with cancer who could not be treated because they were pregnant, severe deformities, life threatening conditions, etc.

I do not approve of abortion or vigilanteism. I think that the "doctor" (in quotes, because real doctors do no harm), in a just world, would have been tried for the countless murders he committed and locked in prison for the rest of his life. However, the murderer also broke the law, and I do condemn that.

Do you think Secretary of HHS Sibelius and President Obama will attend Dr. Tiller's funeral?

The "other side?" Really? The other side is murder. And terrorism. Duh.

Thank you Kelly, for describing the kind of situation in which women who seek late term abortions find themselves. It so rarely gets said that NOBODY is just positively giddy about having an abortion, whether early or late, due to simply not wanting a baby or for health reasons. The fanatics like to make it sound like women just casually go have an abortion because they don't want to change diapers.

Kelly's family who already existed IS AS IMPORTANT AS AN UNBORN FETUS. THEY ARE PEOPLE WHOSE LIVES MATTER, TOO. I'm so glad late abortion was legal for your mother, that she survived, was able to go on to have the baby she wanted, and that she's still there for you and your family. THIS IS WHY ABORTION IS LEGAL. For women and for families!

Good for you Kelly, for telling your story.

Yes, most women have late term abortions to save their lives. Most pro-lifers don't care about the mother and those that love her though, just the fetus. If the fetus has developed terrible birth defects late in the term and the fetus wouldn't be viable after birth, I think the mother/parents should have the option of letting it die at their discretion. After all it is a pregnancy, her/their pregnancy, not some Evangelicals, that was wanted up until her health or the fetus' health went south.

Some people are better able to handle a death after birth and would be comforted by the whole funeral thing and get closure that way. Others are more pragmatic or can't emotionally handle dealing with a post birth death so abort ASAP and get on with their lives perfectly fine after some time for private grieving.

"Women and Families are intellectually, emotionally, spiritually, and ethically competent to struggle with complex health issues - including abortion - and come to decisions that are appropriate for themselves." George R. Tiller, M.D.

If you're against abortion, never have one. Nobody will tell you you have to. But don't tell me that YOU get more control over my body than I do. I and every other woman has the capacity to make that decision. YOU don't get to do that for ME. Deal with it.

One can only wonder about the psychological make up of these so-called 'pro-lifers' (if there is any such thing).........have to be totally warped to kill and promote killing for the sake of an ideology. Wonder how many of these 'pro-lifers' spend any time helping out in orphanages and/or fostering children.

Who would LOVE a job like this? Aborting unborn children in late term?
They are worse than NAZIS!!!!

The pearly gates... that's all I have to say! God will decide the fate of people with hate in their hearts and who do nothing tangible to relieve the plight of those who already born!

@Marv: And all of this totally explains why you are here reading and commenting on this story... It never ceases to amaze me how much time you types find in the day to rage on about "liberal" anything. It is that very same mindless rage that lead to this shooting. Regardless of your political leanings anyone with half an operational brain laughs at the notion that Fox News is "fair and balanced".

1 abortion Dr. is dead. How many INOCCENT babies were killed that day? Do we hear about those?

Kelly...
How do you know that your mother's life would not have been spared had she continued in on the pregnancy? Sadly, since she decided to end the life of your sibling in utero you will never know.
It is a Doctor's job to give us the worst case scenario. And if a doctor were to ever tell me that my pregnancy would end my life. You can bet your life on it that I would find a doctor that would do their best to see me through my pregnancy as far as possible and if needed I would give birth to my baby early enough to save his life and mine. Or if it be Gods will, my life would be terminated. It is not my place (or a doctor's) to decide who dies and when.

Explain to me how people can justify killing someone they accuse of killing someone else? Doesn't that make them exactly what they they rail against?

Neither side of this arguement is correct. There is absolutely NO blanket answer for this issue one way or the other.

i love watching the comments when the crazies come out!

I can't stand the smug look on that doctor's face. All in the service of women. What about the innocent lives she is ending evertime she performs an abortion??? We should be protecting the smallest amongst us not killing them as if they do not matter.

I am one of "these people" that Ms. Derzis villifies.

For years I, along with many others, spent numerous Saturday mornings in front of local abortion clinics. But she and others who claim pro-lifers are violent and angry are lying. I never once saw a pro-lifer yell at anyone. We sought instead to talk peacefully and quietly with people who were visiting the clinic, and if they didn't want to talk we just prayed instead.

One time during all those years, I witnessed a hotheaded young man who joined us on a Saturday morning "lose it" and threaten a woman verbally. (She had reached into her pants and acted as she was smearing her bodily fluids on him.) We removed him from the scene and made sure he never came back.

There is no way a true pro-lifer would ever tolerate a violent act even against someone like Dr. Tiller. For all the pain he caused others, he was still a misguided soul who was not beyond the grace of God.

If you really want to find the killer, look up the boyfriends and husbands of all the women he aborted, who might not have known at the time that he was killing their child. I have met many men who were so angered by this betrayal that they were permanently scarred. These men have no choice in our twisted society.

Despite never having threatened anyone and never even having raised my voice or done anything illegal (I never once trespassed), I myself was arrested more than once, I was the subject of death threats, survived one attempt on my life, was beaten several times by mobs, and was spit upon and screamed countless obscenities at.

Why put yourself through this? For the same reason abolitionists risked their lives. Innocent lives are saved by people who pray in front of abortion clinics and tell the truth to women who will listen. Through our quiet and prayerful witness we saw many women choose life for their children. Lives were saved! There are 20-year-olds alive and walking around today because we took a tough stand.

The truth is that if George Tiller and Diane Derzis had their way, those kids would be dead now.

Abortion is a dangerous topic to begin with, but to say that one life is more important than another is absurd! People who have "medically necessary" abortions usually make their decisions based on what one doctor told them. A doctor who can't predict the future, and is VERY capably of making mistakes. Instead of doing research, seeking a second opinion, or just plainly taking the hand that they were dealt and trusting in God, they rush out to the nearest abortion clinic and "gently empty their uterus". Hoping that the next one will be the one they want, or that maybe they won't make the same mistake twice. I do not, by any means condone the murder of doctors, or clinic workers, but I also don't condone the murder of innocents. I was told during my pregnancy (with a child with a genetic defect) that I could get an abortion and it was ok. I didn't and now I have the most beautiful and wonderful child that I could ever hope to have. Yes, we have medical concerns, doctors appointments, and prescriptions, but seeing my baby smile makes every second worth it. If we hadn't had the amnio done, and had found out about our genetic defect later on in our child's life, we wouldn't have "gently disposed" of our child then either. It is murder, no matter what the age!

Most of the people that kill (abortionist) are men and they can't even get pregnant. What are their beef? If we don't tell you we are pregnant you would not even know we (women) had an abortion or not. You may be living with someone who had an abortion and don't even know it. Men just want to be in control of everything even women bodies.

A ridiculous piece of "news" brought to you by CNN. A deranged individual took the life of another and that is incredibly sad, but even more so is this blatant attempt to paint all abortion opponents as lunatics like this man. If we want to talk about deranged , how about the statement by abortion clinic owner Ms. Derzis that "we are all proud of what we do, we love what we do"..

There is such a thing as pro-abortion, "Mike". I'm pro-abortion, for good reason. I was adopted at birth, in the days when there was no option to terminate the pregnancy that resulted in me. Due to being adopted by parents who were unfit to raise a hamster, I'm a psychological basket case. I wouldn't wish my life on anyone. I'm in favor of being able to terminate any pregnancy at any time.

And all you anti-choicers, give me any legitimate scientific proof that life begins at conception. There is none. Citing that fantasy book you cling to so much isn't proof. If you want to cite a book of ancient wisdom, start citing Aristotle, specifically the difference between potentiality and actuality.

Kelly
you talk about LIFE SAVING MEDICAL CARE. these people killed off one of your brothers or sisters. how is this considered life saving? someone was murdered rather than dying of natural causes. i pray for these young HUMAN beings(fetus) that arent granted the same rights we have as older(SICK) human beings have. may they all rest in peace.

Hell with you folks...anti abortisionists..

why the hell you hav an issue with abortion. it is a right of every woman in this country to decide whether to have a baby or not. You dont have that right.

If you say that you are killing fetus..why the hell you are killing so many animals and eating them. you cowards. On gods name , you do so many unpardonable crimes. you dont have any right to dictate terms to anybody.

after all it is a womans right to decide to have abortion or not. and you better dont stand in protests near clinics. one day all of you will be smashed from this copuntry.. get last before your are thrown out of this free country .

Why do people who are so religious or spiritual try so hard to push thier beliefs down other people's throat? We have a constitution of laws that state what we can and cannot do, why is that not good enough. What ever reason a woman has for choosing to have an abortion is just that, Her choice. It is not the next person's choice but hers. If it is not you then stay out of other people's buisness. If you don't believe in abortion don't have one. But don't try to stop others from exercising thier right to choose.

O'Reilly portrayed Tiller as a murderer on the loose, and anybody who wasn't using every trick in the book to lock him up was supposedly corrupt (Tiller had just been acquitted by a jury of sixteen dubious charges). He said Governor Sebelius had "blood on her hands." I don't know how you portray somebody providing legal services as an outlaw, and everybody not stopping him from providing them as perverting the law for evil ends, and then say you're not encouraging vigilante justice, but O'Reilly obviously will.

Tucker Carson just said calling Tiller "Tiller the Baby Killer" as O'Reilly routinely does is "objectively true," and described him as "a monster," but of course said murdering the monster was wrong.

You know, it's interesting that these people call abortion providers and anybody supports them "killers" and bloodthirsty and callous and lawless and everything you can think of. Tiller is the seventh abortion provider and the fifth doctor to be murdered, and there have been seventeen attempted murders. Not to mention violent attacks on women trying to enter the facilities. I know of absolutely no case where one of the "murdering" doctors even fired back in self defense, or of any violent attacks on people like Randall Terry. The "murderers" just perform abortions. The "defenders of the victims" make nail bombs or shoot doctors in church, or just get other suckers to do it for them.

Word. This is legal, this service that these people provide and if your country isn't going to stop the violence against these law-abiding people then WTF? Your religious views on when life begins are your's and your's alone. Please respect the religious pluralism upon which America was founded.

Dr. Derzis spoke the truth and the "pro-lifers" who are offended are being hypocritical. Operation Rescue shut down their website yesterday and today got rid of most of their "Tiller Watch" content.

Why? I believe is to try to shield themselves of any responsibility.

I have been on multiple Christian, pro-life and conservative blogs and most bloggers/commentators are not only not condoning this assassination, they have in fact been mockingly referring to the murder of Dr. Tiller as a "late term abortion".

These pro-life groups, most of them identifying themselves as "Christians" are just the same if not WORSE than Al-Quaeda and Muslim terrorist.

The Muslim terrorist are NOT exploiting the First Amendment and waving American flag!

The pro-life movement uses Jesus and Biblical scriptures to justify hate, discrimination, violence, terror, ignorance, destruction and fear.

Dr. Derzis, is right. It is only going to get more violent. as these group face reality that they lost the White House, Congress and the majority of Americans are NOT on their side.

The federal government has to step up and jail these people as part of the war on terror!

WHAT IF A PREGNANT WOMEN GOES TO ONE OF THESE
ABORTION DOCTORS AND THE BABY POSES NO RISK
TO THEIR HEALTH OR THEIR LIFE. THESE DOCTORS
WILL ABORT A PREGNANCY FOR ANY REASON BECAUSE
" THEY LOVE WHAT THEY DO" , "IT'S A CALLING"
" FOR WHAT EVER REASON THEY WERE FORCED TO
TERMINATE"

It's all a matter of trust. The world in which we live is growing more secular by the day. More confidence is placed in the hands of modern medicine and the so-called scientists whose theories are always under revision than the creator which science can not disprove. What shambles this country is in because of it's failure to obey the commandments of God. Killing babies, homosexuality, child abuse and moral relativism are the direct result of a nation that surrenders all conviction and sears the consciences of our citizens to fulfill their own lusts without reservation. I am a veteran. A disturbed one who prays for our troops and fears that the battles are just beginning for a once Christian nation whose leaders (Democrat and Republican) care nothing for the Bible or the moral values it could provide them in leading the people out of the decades of apostasy. God loves all men and women (no matter the race, sexual orientation or past sins). Yet His covenant to bless humanity here and in eternity hinges on obedience to his Word and following of the Living Word Jesus Christ's example.

Even as someone who is pro-choice, I am not stupid enough to think that this act of murder represents the wishes of all pro-life supporters. I'm sure very few people would believe that, though I know more people than I'd like to think whisper under their breath, "Amen". Personally, I think if you are pro-life, I think that you should be about letting people live, as the name implies?

I wish people would stop using the term "baby killer." I understand why people feel like this, but I don't, either. I am sad that some pro-life people I know look at things in black and white. I know that they feel firmly in their feelings about what is right and what is wrong, and there are no in-betweens. But there are so many complicated situations in this world. I know some will be offended to use my comparison of a fetus's situation to that of a "mere animal's", but please read: I just recently put my cat, my great friend of 17 years to sleep. I possibly spent more time with her than anyone. Putting her to death wasn't the simple "right thing to do", I had so many mixed feelings. For months we gave her fluids, medicines. In the end, I tended to this cat for days, barely sleeping, unsure about what I should do. She was suffering. But she sometimes could be happy. But she was unable to eat on her own, walk, she was stuffed with medicine. It was no way to live. She could have lived on a few more days, but how did she feel? She stared with unmoving eyes at everything, my friend who used to have strangely intelligent eyes, the one who sometimes looked at me and petted me back. We say making our pet friends die can be merciful. Can it also be merciful for us to do this to our unborn who have no choice, the ones who did not even ask to be born? And our sick and even willing to die, too? Sometimes it might be more cruel and painful to keep certain, rare babies alive. The choice to terminate these pregnancies is often very painful. Do not assume late terminations are always ok'd by people who feel simply inconvenienced by a baby. Read up on it more and try to understand the feelings of your "enemies", and why they feel these procedures can be merciful. Don't just think about things so simply. You could be making the world a more painful place for many people.

No one wants to see a person shot down.....in church no less...but this abortionist was no saint...he has been making millions of dollars every year killing babies. He has killed over 60,000 babies since 1973. Yes, some pregnancies maybe life threatening... I've never met a woman who "had" to get an abortion. I've known 4 women in my life who had were advised that abortion was an option to terminate their pregnancy. Two for cancer. Both mothers had the support of their doctors and family and chose to continue the pregnancy and both women had treatment after the babies where born. Both children are perfect. Both mother's lived. The other two mothers had babies with birth defects. One was born without a brain the other had massive heart problems. Both these mothers chose to continue and were supported in their decision. One baby lived 2 hours and the other 30 days. If this child could have gotten a heart transplant she would have lived. Her mother loved her enough to inconvenience herself and do everything she could to give her a chance to live. Abortion is used as birth control plain and simple. With abortionist scarying women that if they "need" and abortion that right won't be there. It's all about the money. I have never known any woman who aborted a healthy fetus who later didn't regret that decision. I've heard them say "It would have been better if I had given the baby up for adoption." Or the 17 year old who wrote, "yesterday I killed someone!" What women don't realize is this is a big event in your life. Whether you carry that baby full term or you have it killed you remember that day. It never leaves your heart. You remember the pain and the cost to your pocket book and to your soul. Not one woman has ever told me it was the right thing to do. But I have seen them sad on the anniversary of the date they chose to end that babies life. I've had them tell me they had 3 children but they lost one. Then cry and tell me they made a stupid mistake when they were young. Planned Parenthood and these abortionist don't care if you need counciling to get past this they are heartless and never give it another thought once you leave their door. But we do. We think about how that 15 minutes is always with us. Everytime you have a new doctor you have to retell the story. When your examined once a year you relive those minutes long ago. But to them it's just a quick buck while they say they are "helping" young women. You can't tell me that 60,000 women were in danger of dying if their pregnancies continued. We are so afraid to say stop using this as birth control and start protecting your self from STD's/ HIV AIDS and pregnancy. If your getting pregnant your exposing yourself to all kinds of sexually transmitted deseases. If we really cared about women we would make sure that the 18 year old who gets the 12 year old pregnant faces the police instead of just paying to kill the evidence. Again no one wants to see some one shot but maybe the guy who shot the abortionist was a guy who didn't have a voice when his child was distroyed.

I bet if you limited the amount abortionist could charge to $25.00 they would go into another line of business. You don't have to even think twice to suction a womb out. You would see how important it was for them to "help" young women then. People mag. had 5 or 6 young people's stories a few weeks back. They where all born prior to 28 weeks and lived to become productive well educated citizens because their doctor did everything he could to save them. A real doctor does no harm.

They are Terrorists, our own home grown version of Al Qaeda. They terrorize women who try to get to a clinic. They terrorize and murder doctors. I hope that more people will stand up now for our freedom and support lawful abortions in the US. I hope people will stand up and denounce the pro life hate groups as the terrorists which they are.

I can understand the pro life position, because it does mean to be honorable. The problem is when you have a large mass of people (about 60 million take this position, compared to 60 million who favor choice, and the 180 million who are in the middle) there are going to be a large number of people who are going to engage in antisocial, even homicidal, behaviors. This is why many clinics have become fortified against attack; there is a real problem out there, and the leaders of the pro-life movement MUST change the direction of the behavior of thosewho follow them. It is hard to respect people who scream at and shove women who just showed up for condoms and pregnancy tests, but still are treated like dirt, or worse.

Now consider the behavior of Operatin Rescue in particular. Randall Terry used to go around with am aborted fetus in a box. This is disturbing in the very least; I found it apalling. Does not Christian tradition, and Christianity is the basis for for the opposition to abortion, call for the dead to be buried and put to rest? Please understand that such behavior does NOT help your cause.

I myself am pro choice, but like I said, I understand and respect those who oppose me. My one demand of the pro life community is that the people act responsibly and with compassion. You always say that life and family are important; now I would very much appreciate hearing SOMEONE say something kind to his family, " a wife, four children and 10 grandchildren."

Looks like the doctor did believe in both family values and life.

Let the man without sin throw the first stone, especially when that sin is Wrath.

Absolutely disgusting and unbelievable! Please, apply logic and reason to what all you pro-choice advocates are saying–that under the pretext of a life-threatening condition to a pregnant woman abortions are justified. C'mon! In this day and age, with the technology we have and medical advances we've made you tell me we do not have any alternatives? Someone is making money off of the innocent, a ton of money. Shame on you.

I cannot believe the comments I am reading in here. Radical Christians, supposed pro-life organizations have been spreading propaganda putting doctors in the target for years, just waiting for people to do the dirty job. It's called plausible deniability. They call these doctors murderers, baby killers and tell public that these doctors deserve death. Then someone assassinates the doctors and pro-life people who have been hoping for this assassination claim they condemn the killings. That's the most disgusting hipocrisy. Pro-life for babies, pro-assassination for doctors. Shame on pro-life organizations, for being accomplice in this crime, whether they hired or merely have shown the target to the hitmen. This is unacceptable in a free democracy.

Pat-

"He knew the risk. He lost."

So it's ok that the doctor was murdered? In a church no less?

I teach at a school with many (recovering?) drug addicts and criminals. So if one of them shoots me, do I deserve to die because I knew it was risky?

Police and firefighters have risky jobs where they face death to protect us. So if someone shoots them, is it okay too? Release the cop killers back into our communities?

Please respond to the widows and orphans of these brave people. My fiancee worries about my safety at my job. If I get shot, will you look her in the eye and tell her that is just what happens to someone with a risky job?

If anyone is convinced that they are irrefutably correct, please add Vanity to their list of sins. Yes I watch out for it too, which is why I am trying to listen to those who disagree with me and show respect.

May God bless you Pat. I just hope that you can do the same for me, another human being who is trying to make sense of such a hard topic as this one.

A few people have commented on the irony that white middle aged men, who even with 21st century modern technology can still not get pregnant; are usually the ones who have murdered abortion providers, and/or bombed clinics, etc.

Abortion is not about life, it is about power. Historically men have been trying to dominate women, and nothing rattles them more than a woman who is in control of herself.

So you may challenge me with "what about the women" in the pro-life movement?

Sadly, because the movement purports itself to be a "Christian" movement and the subjugation of women is referenced in their patriarchal bible, there are some women who do believe that women have no rights over their bodies.

I don't think violence is the answer. It is not about birth control and they know it. They have a much larger agenda. Apparently they go to work happy to promote the same human genocide suggested by people like Margaret Sanger. They seek to engineer America and the human race to be what they want. Here is the secret agenda of Planned Parenthood in Margaret Sanger's words:

"The most merciful thing that a large family does to one of its infant members is to kill it."
Margaret Sanger, Women and the New Race
(Eugenics Publ. Co., 1920, 1923)

On blacks, immigrants and indigents:
"...human weeds,' 'reckless breeders,' 'spawning... human beings who never should have been born." Margaret Sanger, Pivot of Civilization, referring to immigrants and poor people

On sterilization & racial purification:
Sanger believed that, for the purpose of racial "purification," couples should be rewarded who chose sterilization. Birth Control in America, The Career of Margaret Sanger, by David Kennedy, p. 117, quoting a 1923 Sanger speech.

On the right of married couples to bear children:
Couples should be required to submit applications to have a child, she wrote in her "Plan for Peace." Birth Control Review, April 1932

On the purpose of birth control:
The purpose in promoting birth control was "to create a race of thoroughbreds," she wrote in the Birth Control Review, Nov. 1921 (p. 2)

On the rights of the handicapped and mentally ill, and racial minorities:
"More children from the fit, less from the unfit - that is the chief aim of birth control." Birth Control Review, May 1919, p. 12

On the extermination of blacks:
"We do not want word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population," she said, "if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members." Woman's Body, Woman's Right: A Social History of Birth Control in America, by Linda Gordon

On respecting the rights of the mentally ill:
In her "Plan for Peace," Sanger outlined her strategy for eradication of those she deemed "feebleminded." Among the steps included in her evil scheme were immigration restrictions; compulsory sterilization; segregation to a lifetime of farm work; etc. Birth Control Review, April 1932, p. 107

Hey Marv, Lifers did target doctors in this case. Get off your high horse.

I think some people are confusing "pro-choice" with "pro-abortion." I am pro-choice, but not pro-abortion. I don't think we should ENCOURAGE abortions. I don't think abortions are AWESOME! If you are "pro abortion" it means you think MORE women should have abortions and you think abortion is a great idea.

I hope nobody actually thinks abortion is a "great idea", but rather, a medical procedure that is unfortunate but necessary. As the saying goes, Abortions should be safe – legal – and very rare.

We all need the right to respond with deadly force. Anti-abortion activitists would not be so threatening if the clinics had armed guards and all workers there given the right to carry a concealed weapon– strictly self-defense. Remember no one was given the right to kill american nazis and klansman on the spot no matter how heinous they are.

Further, anti-abortionists should be subject to hate speech as a hate crime. It is one thing to disageed and another to foment riots and murder.

Time once again for some misguided outrage and irony-laced proclamations from the pro-choice lobby, necessary to deflect from the gruesome, everyday reality of what they're really promoting:

"Of coure, noone is pro-abortion." Make sure not to read the article you're commenting on, or you'll read about a doctor who loves her job providing abortions. I bet she even makes money from them.

"The anti-abortion movement is the violent party in this dispute. None of the abortion doctors ever react to threats of violence with violence." Maybe those doctors get their fill of violence during their workday. Besides, the unborn are rarely packing heat in utero, so it's statistically much safer Dr. Tiller's way, his demise notwithstanding.

"Abortion doctors are providing life-saving medical care to women who would otherwise be giving birth to babies with terrible pain and deformities." Are there really millions of deformed, unviable, mother-endangering babies conceived in the U.S. every year – what exactly is in our water? I wonder what Dr. Tiller's "unviable monstrosity" to "major inconvenience" ratio was...

"These pro-life radical Christians are just as bad as Islamic terrorists". Right, because radical Islam has only killed 5 people and injured a few more over the span of the last 16 years.

"Abortion is legal. First-degree murder isn't." This one is true, though there seem to be legitimate questions about whether Dr. Tiller actually performed certain illegal late-term abortions, despite his acquittal. In the end, the presumption of innocence didn't help Dr. Tiller any more than it helped the unborn children he aborted.

Something tells me that the number of abortions for convenience in the last 16 years is much greater than 5, so perhaps the pro-choice movement might want to reconsider their proclivity to make moral pronouncements about this crime.

To I don't regret mine: Rarely have I ever seen such a selfish rationale for murder. Nothing that you accomplish will take away the stain of killing your own baby to achieve it. I went through law school with a woman who had had a baby at 12, made it through high school, college, and law school. I have the greatest admiration for her and her accomplishments. If you have no regrets, then you have no decency.

There is no such thing as an "abortion doctor."

A doctor who performs abortions is an obstetrician-gynecologist. Such doctors perform a wide variety of medical services for women: wellness exams; cancer screenings; family-planning and birth-control services; disease prevention and treatment; prenatal/perinatal care, etc.

Also, there is no such thing as an "abortion clinic."

Abortions are performed at hospitals and at women's health clinics. Women's health clinics provide a very wide variety of health-care services for women, including services that prevent unintended pregnancies, thereby reducing the number of abortions sought.

It would be awesome if CNN could use more accurate/less incendiary language when reporting about such topics. The people who have dedicated their careers/lives to women's health probably would appreciate it, I'm sure.

Matt because you were "educated" by the Jesuits you think you can be pro-choice and Catholic, thus is the result of a corrupt order. ...

"On the other hand, I can’t recall any massacre, even on a small scale, caused by a brotherhood of Doctors." quoted from Andy.
I believe you being out of the world and not really understanding what is going on. Many doctors were responsible for test and killings in concentration camp, abortion itself is a mass killing performed by doctors.
-The point missing here is the root of the problem. The Doctor wants money and they get paid to do it.
-The goverment authorizes this mass killing.
-One person under free will comes to the clinic to get this baby killed.
-One person executes his/her free will and gets laid with anyone they want, forgetting about responsabilities.
-It takes 2 to get a woman pregnant,
- So the point here is choose better when and with whom you will get laid, so you can take the consequences, And the result is supposed to be life, not death and regret.
LOVE a BABY and Be LOVED for ther rest of your life, a real love, unconditional love.
Killing a doctor or an abortionist will not help LIFE.
Pro-Choice, choose better before having sex just for lack of anything else better to do. Choose to help the community.

"i dont regret mine June 2nd, 2009 12:05 am ET"

That's got to be the most rediculous thing I've ever heard. If you had just kept your legs closed in the first place or used protection or some sort of birth control, then your unborn child wouldn't have had to pay for your "good time" with his or her life.

Pregnancy from rape or incest, yeah the argument could be made that abortion should be an option. Medical necessity, maybe after extensive testing, but if you just don't want the kid because it will cramp your lifestyle, or because you did something stupid, then you are a sick individual.

Abortion does not have to be a religious topic, although for many people it is. But it should be discussed and debated as a physiological, or medical topic.

Additionally, if men want women to have kids as a form of control over them, the why are most abortion providers men. Get a new argument.

Also, if you are a woman who gets pregnant through some choice of your own, or from something you can control, then it is YOUR problem. Don't make your kids pay for your mistake. I know plenty of people who would love to adopt a kid. And babies don't stay in orphanages or with foster parents the way older children do. So get another new argument.

Also, Roeder was a complete nutjob. But he was not a terrorist. He is an extremist who happens to be a Christian, who killed another Christian in a church. He didn't kill anyone else. He didn't shoot up the entire church. He is just a nut, but not a terrorist. And equating pro-life people to terrorists or Jihadists is a piss poor argument. After all, who is the ones taking lives here.

Wow, this entire thing saddens me so much and I live across a very big ocean. Murder is never justifiable. This man had to wear a flak jacket to Church! and he dealt with this every day.

Any abortion is a tragedy but womens don't get an abortion as contraception, it's a horrendous decision that will alwasy be the most difficult thing in any woman's life. Why make it harder? Better sex ed, better access to family planning resources would help anyone who doesn't want to see more abortions happen, but this murder won't prevent anything and a family has lost a husband, a father, a grandfather.

If Christ was alive today, he wouldn't be a christian. You "pro lifers" make me sick. Tiller's death is a sad and horrible thing, I meet him and he was a wonderful man. He talked about his family and grand children and all the women's life's he help. The only thing that will come of this man's death is less women's right and maybe back alley abortions too.

Don't think these people threaten our lives, even as we walk into our MD's office to pick up birth control or have our annual Well-woman exam? I urge you to simply read their comments above and then tell me again that my experience is untrue and that Ms. Derzis is a liar.

Karen,

You know Karen if you type the words "abortion clinics" in Google search you will find thousands of places referred to or called "ABORTION CLINICS" . Oh, they may call themselves euphemistically Reproductive Health Clinics but no reproduction is going on. Just the opposite. The deliberate killing of unborn human lives. On the THESE ABORTION CLINIC WEB SITES you will see euphemisms all through their little web sites like "products of conception" for unborn child or "fetal demise" instead the killing of the living fetus by lethal injection. Or "the safe and gentle procedure" for the dismemberment and mutilation of the unborn child's body during the brutal, bloody abortion. So yea right Karen you won't find ABORTION CLINICS as their formal business titles but that is exactly what they are. The money from those killings are what keeps them in business to do the other services at their death clinics.

The doctor should have been shot but, not at Church. This man has commited many murders performing abortions. None of his victims had commited any crime nor had done anything wrong. The doctor's victims could not defend themselves. The people that have abortions have not respect for God or God's laws. These people don't have any respect for themselves. One day, a nurse saw another nurse walking down the hall with a bundle in her arms. She was asked what was in her arms. The nurse said she had an aborted baby and was taking it into another room to let it die. If that mother was in the same circumstances as that aborted baby, I guarantee you, she would change her mind. Even if the whole world says that abortion is right does not mean that it is right. That aborted baby may have become someone that found the cure for cancer or do some other helpful task. Even raped mothers said they were glad that they had the child.
What goes around, comes around.

Thank you Raymond!!!!

People who are for abortions say they have a right to abortion. Nothing could be further from the truth. This is like saying you have the right to do anything you want. I don't think you will find that kind of reasoning in the Bible. The people who support abortion are as guilty as the person that has the abortion. I wonder when we will start killing old people after they reach the age of 70 because it is too costly to keep them alive or they are taking up too much oxygen?

Raymond Johnson-

"The doctor should have been shot but, not at Church."

Sir, I must protest this statement of incitement to murder.

Furthermore, consider the precedents that you set by this:

1. Shooting people of another political party because they disagree with you

2. Shooting people because they are of another religion

3. Shooting people because they punlish materials that you disagree with

Remember why our ancestors came here in the first place?

So do you believe in the first amendment or not? Do you belive in the law, or are you completely above it?

Anyone want to take up a collection to give him a one-way ticket to a place that he belongs? Russia, China, or Iran?

By the way, the Bible does not say to "go forth and sin some more." Must be a typo. Wrath and Vanity. History repeats.

Dude-

Baaaaaaaaaaa. Stop being such a follower and get a life, please.

First of all, abortion will always be a hot controversial topic. I do not believe protestors should be allowed outside of abortion clinics to start with. It is a medical place of business. These women who go to these clinics are going through enough and will always live with their decision to have an abortion. It is no ones right to take that away. Baby killers or not, that is their life and decision and not some protestor's opinion who knows nothing surrounding the issues the woman is facing. Truth is if abortion were illegal, are these righteous people going to raise these unwanted, maybe deformed, retarded babies? I dont think so. Many would not be given up for abortion and raised in a life of hell abused, etc. I have two children and never had an abortion but that right to women, I would never take away. By the way, I was told by my obsetrician to consider a late term abortion because i was told my child would be born with trisomy 18 and would suffer and die by the time it was a year old. Thank God, the first testing was wrong after worrying for two weeks. So you do not know the situation of these women to judge!

Good job CNN. As a young woman, I hope that one day I live to see abortion not be a political issue at all. Here is how I feel about the issue:

1) MEN should not have a say over what happens to WOMENS bodies. PERIOD.

2) We live in a country that values the separation of church and state. Some pro-lifers on this forum view abortion as a religious abomination, and that may be, but this is NOT a religious issue, it is a FEDERAL issue that should not be decided by religious reasoning.

3) Pro-choice people do not want people to have abortions, we want people to have OPTIONS and RIGHTS. Pro-choice does not mean pro-abortion!

4) If pro-lifers value ALL life, then why do most support waging wars that kill innocent people (often children) and the death penalty. So does this mean that all people have the right to be born but then once they are born we have the right to kill them?

5) This is a very sad event and this man should be charged and prosecuted to the full extent.

6) Any pro-lifers who condone this type of behavior are HYPOCRITES!

Saying that all pro-life supporters are terrorists is like saying that all Germans are Nazi's.

KELLY: LIFE SAVING MEDICAL CARE?? Are you serious?? You honestly think that? Gimmie a break...SOME are LIFE SAVING MEDICAL CARE but MOST of them are KILLING INNOCENT BABIES for own self preservation....who has 3 + 4 LIFE SAVING MEDICAL CARE for the same problem? Unless you have CANCER? The Doctors do it for profit and people do it for their own selfish reasons. So I guess it is like a cancer.... GET REAL!!!

HOLLY: The people who come to reproductive health care facilities are not peaceful. They yell phrases so terrible most of us never have to experience.... WHAT? HAHAHAHA Not peaceful? How do you remain peaceful about a widespread legalized BABY KILLING SQUAD? Yelling phrases so terrible most of us never have to experience??? YOU ARE A JOKE!!! Ummm lemme see whats more TERRIBLE, yelling phrases or KILLING BABIES??? YOU PEOPLE ARE LOST!!! How can you JUSTIFY BABY KILLING??? HOW?

Now I'm not the type to say you gonna rot in hell and all that junk...because no matter what we do as humans God forgives us if we ask for it. I think that we should come up with a SOLUTION to the problem and not just Hate each other so much and not get anywhere while babies continue to die. So my question is if, WHAT WOULD IT TAKE FOR A POTENTIAL MOM/ WOMAN NOT TO HAVE AN ABORTION? Money? Stability? what?? Why do so many women choose ABORTION? Is that the ONLY option?

Rob-

What if he had missed and killed a kid? Or a pregnent woman? Not funny.

The fact that Rob is even allowed to post this ignorant crap just shows that CNN is not monitoring the boards correctly. It is neanderthals like Rob that are the reason why this country has so many problems. This man was murdered for holding a controversial political view. What is this, Somalia?

Rob-

Okay let's take another step forward. Does pro-life mean that also the living should not die either?

I will offer you a little respect if you can do the same.

Stephen

bfarrington, Stephen,....Have you ever felt a baby moving and kicking inside your girlfriend or wife? Have you ever felt your son or daughter having hick-ups, playfully touching your hand or being startled at a loud noise; have you ever loved your son or daughter before he/she was even born?.......Probably not.

You see, to me and many others you are direct representatives of the evil that has brought this once great Country down to her knees and eventual destruction.......You call me the neanderthal; you almost make me laugh; you are the ones who want to kill innocent little babies.

Rob-

"You see, to me and many others you are direct representatives of the evil that has brought this once great Country down to her knees and eventual destruction."

What that last coment towards myself?

I believe that I have expressed value for the lives of children, women, the unborn (note pregnant women), and living people.

I also have four great nephews; kids in two years, we think, after the econonmic recovery.

I am really trying to talk WITH you not just talk AT you.

Thanks,

Stephen

Stephen
I apologize to you; you sound like a decent man, however, I don't believe we'll ever agree on this one..... And maybe I overestimate you but I think, if given the chance, you would shoot to kill, if not given a choice, a man who is causing bodily harm to your wife or another loved one......Roeder probably thought he didn't have a choice. In his mind he was protecting the innocent against a man he probably considered to be a legitimate serial killer.

Rob-

Thanks. Finally, a moment of decency that I can appreciate.

Okay, like I have said before, I do honor the pro-life idea for having their heart in a good place. That is why I am trying to have a civilized conversation with you and anyone else who wants to listen. I think I know now how convey a critical idea about Roeder and his actions across to you. So sit back, relax, and consider this issue:

Think about how with the bailout on Wall Street people have been talking about the "moral hazard" of rewarding bad behavior.

Now consider the Roeder problem for a minute. I do not think any parent would raise children with the idea that killing people in church is a good thing. Roeder's deadly sin is Vanity; psychologists would call it megalomania. He believes in a decent enough idea: protect the unborn. The problem he has is that he believes that he is above the law when it comes to putting his otherwise good idea forward. He believes himself to be beyond reproach and above the responsibility of the responsible citizen. He actually wants people to respect what he did, and some people actually do, beyond the Cause that he stands for. Roeder makes the mistake of believing that he and his actions define and are even greater than the cause that he claims to serve. He sees himself as a martyr who other people will respect and follow.

Here is where the "moral hazard" occurs. If we say that an execution outside of the law is okay, than ANY citizen can decide who lives and who dies. The thing that makes a civilization great is one that has Law as its foundation; by going outside of the law, and indeed against it, we cannot say what he did is okay without saying that Law, and our civilization is not worth it. We then create a precedent where "Thou shall not Kill" has an exemption; does not the pro-life movement argue that there are no exemptions to this commandment?

Let me draw a personal example, if I may. On the back of my teaching license, it says that I shall report to the authorities those who would harm a minor child (who I serve in a professional capacity, such as one of my own students.) If I see another child who I do not legally serve (such as a random child in another town) and they are being abused, I report not with any legal authority, but simply as another good citizen. Here I am at the limit of of the law, and I can not go further than that without legal and moral risks.

Now, let us say that I now think, "I know better than anyone else." I speak, but I do not listen. I do not look to honorable examples that have come before me, but instead think that I am going to do better than anyone else. So I say, why report a crime when I can prevent one? I start to hang out at the local parks looking for perverts that I think are going to harm children, and I start to kill them on my own hook, rather than letting the law do its proper work. Without a jury trial, and proper procedure of Law, I could get it wrong. I could be hurting a man who is merely watching his own kid that he is separated from due to a divorce. (Roeder could have missed and killed a kid, or ironically a pregnant woman.) The true mark of self-destruction here is that any other right thinking man could come to the (wrong) conclusion, seeing me hanging out at the park, that I am the one who is the pervert, and by my own ideas, they would be right to kill ME.

Now here is the final irony that no one has yet considered. This one takes some moral courage to face, so I ask to face the other way this could have happened:

I am in the church that fateful day. I see Roeder pull his gun and aim at Tiller. I draw my gun and shoot Roeder before he can pull the trigger. If the local prosecutor put me on trial, and you were on the jury, would your vote be Guilty, Not Guilty, or Innocent?

"And maybe I overestimate you but I think, if given the chance, you would shoot to kill, if not given a choice, a man who is causing bodily harm" lethal harm, to anyone, in a church?

Take care Rob

Stephen

Rob-

Just to clarify, when I say a moment of decency, I mean that a lot of people on both sides can't seem to behave on this board. Sorry if you thought that I was singling you out for criticism on that isue.

The 1st Amendment has done much to make America great. I am not trying to convince you or anyone else to change their position on abortion. What worries me is that so many people are willing to forgive this murderer. There are right ways and wrong things of fighting for what you believe. To say this is ok sends the wrong message to a lot of people.

Like the kids who saw the shooting.

Take care,

Stephen

The argument that Roeder acted outside of the law or believes himself to be above the law is more liberal hogwash. It is a long-standing legal principle that there are perfectly legal reasons for killing another human, namely defense of self or defense of others. Clearly Roeder was acting on the second reason, namely he believed that he was acting to defend the most innocent among us. Argue whether abortion is right or wrong, but get over yourselves and your BS arguments about Roeder seeing himself as above the law. Or, next time somebody mugs you, refrain from fighting back. Your ilk clearly doesn't believe in defense of others, so why should you have the right to defense of self?

Oberon-

Self defense requires a person to be present at the scene of a crime. Roeder can't claim that because:

1. He wasn't there when the abortions were performed. Someone mugging me accepts the fact of my presence, so yes I can act, thank you very much.
2. The only case for self defense would have been if it was his offspring directly involved, also assuming he was again, present at the clinic.
3. There is no due process of law. If I think the bus driver is a pervert, and kill him to protect your kids or anyone else's, then I have violated due process.
4. Since he wasn't there, the case is simply murder in the 1st degree, as it was premeditated. As it was politically motivated, it will also be labeled terrorism (correctly.) This qualifies as special circumstances.
5. So, despite his claims, Roeder will, according to the law, be excecuted.
6. The law is there to be followed. If you want to change it, you do so through the LEGAL process. Otherwise, don't complain if someone steals an election, robs the bank with your retirement, rapes your daughter, kills your son, or does anything else that you don't like, because YOU are saying that LAW DOES NOT MATTER.
7. Do I really have to state the consequences of lawlessness to you? Families should be protected, but without law, who will protect them for us when we are not at home because we are at work? (Is there anything that I can say to get you to listen? I REALLY take no pleasure in writing #6, but that is where the consequences lie. Peace unto you and yours Oberon.)

Law does matter. More often than not, it does protect the citizens of out great country. If you hate our country's laws, you hate my country.
You are then telling me that the people who died for it have died for nothing. You tell me that the people who defend it today against Terrorists (from without AND within) are wasting their time.

Beware of Wrath, for it clouds the mind. I have managed to resit telling you what I really feel, because I refuse to give in to Wrath, and instead I try to stick to (sometimes unpleasant) facts.

And still no one has directly answered my question from before:

I am in the church that fateful day. I see Roeder pull his gun and aim at Tiller. I draw my gun and shoot Roeder before he can pull the trigger. If the local prosecutor put me on trial, and you were on the jury, would your vote be Guilty, Not Guilty, or Innocent?

Oberon, by your self- defense argument, I am free to go right?

Thank you for proving my point.

Stephen

p.s

Rob-

Haven't heard back from you in a while. I hope you and yours are well and are able to respond to my "in church" question soon.

Thanks,

Stephen

If you have not sat in a room and had a doctor tell you how terribly your child is going to suffer before they die, and how you do have ONE option to save them from that pain – to terminate the pregnancy – you have no room to judge Dr. Tiller or those who needed his services.

I was taught that God is love and compassion. We gave up the child we dearly wanted because he would suffer terribly otherwise. God, not you, will judge me.

You have your right to your beliefs, but stop infringing on mine.

Stephen-

To answer your question I would have to say "not guilty" ; you were clearly doing what you thought was right by preventing the loss of a life of that of an unarmed man.

But as far as your earlier comments about the law, was not our own Country formed illegally? You are a teacher Stephen; do you know your history?

Let me ask you this: if you lived in New England during the time of the revolution, would you have been an upstanding loyalist and obeyed the tyranical laws of the British? Would you have, as a good citizen, informed on the rebelious revolutionaries?

Another question: was it right for our Country to go to War with Germany? Many innocents were killed in our bombings....was it justified?

You may say that the above questions have nothing to do with the subject....but in fact they have EVERYTHING to do with the subject.

In every society there are a few good men with convictions. These men cannot stay quiet and do nothing while bad people rule and pollute the world with their filth.

There is an old saying.....Good men do not obey bad laws.

Rob

Dr Tiller was such a brave man. He and his couragous staff and volunteers saved the lives of many women and girls. They saved the health of many more. It is shameful that he was not adequately protected by Kansas state and local authorities.

It sickens me to to read Taliban style nonsense here in America. Women and girls are not expendable.

I've read a few pro-life comments. They probably loose a lot of arguments. Perhaps that's why so many think violence is a swell idea.

I hope people will see the self-named pro-life movement for what it really is. When that happens the political arm of the movement will no longer be permitted to incite the terrorist arm to carry out its wishes.

Guys who want abortion outlawed need to look closer to home. You have to know that innocent sperm are human life. Have you considered the holocaust that occurs every time you get, er, excited? Quit merely pretending purity and sin no more!

Rob-

Thank you. Your decency is appreciated.

Germany- if we had stopped Hitler before he remilitarized the Ruhr, at Anchluss, or at Czechoslovakia, we could have saved tens of millions of lives. We waited too long, penny wise, pound foolish! (so you are wrong in the way you intended (not participating), but kind of right in that you have to act now to save more lives later.)

Revolution- Great question! The answer is that they DID try to get what they wanted through the system, but the system had 'no representation' for them. So at the end of the day, the only choice was to part ways. England did have a choice to let them go peacefully, but chose war instead. (It was inevitable anyway that the colonists would one day go their own way; all colonies of the Great Powers have since become independent.)

The point is that here there are several ways to properly agitate for pro-life policies. State legislatures, Congress, referendums, state and federal court, to name a few.

If the pro-life movement would get away from the clinic protests, and instead assemble for silent candelight vigils, sing hymns, and GENTLY invite onlookers to join them, they would have a better chance of claiming the 'moral high ground' in American political life.
It is going to have to stop 'preaching to the choir' and start really trying to change the minds of those who disagree with them. If the movement INSISTS on keeping up clinic protests, the character of these assemblies has to radically change to support adoption for the women who come by the clinics. It simply has to stop doing what it WANTS to do and start doing what it NEEDS to do to succeed, otherwise it won't succeed. The civil rights movement succeeded by peaceful protests, facing dogs, clubs, water cannon, and lynchings, and it succeeded.

Unfortunately, the people who are pro-life are often against contraception and education, which REDUCES the demand for abortions in the first place! I totally think that we should reduce abortions, by reducing the number of pregnant teenagers (who have no way to INDEPENDENTLY support their new families, without being dependent on their own families, government welfare, or the FELONS who got them pregnant in the first place!) Almost all of the pregnant and teen mothers that I have dealt with say the same thing,"I din't know what I was getting in to!"

We won't resolve this issue today. I just think that shooting people in church is wrong when there are better ways to accomplish a goal. You are welcome to your beliefs, which I may disagree with, but I still respect. If you are ever in California, maybe we can sit down over a meal and talk some more, or even have a debate in my classroom. (I can probably get CNN to forward my email to you if you would wish it.)

Best wishes for you and your family,

Stephen

Well, well, well. I am quite faccinated that these "men" who claim to be such "pure and godly men" also would be the same men who would "throw the first stone" that Jesus had a personal problem with. The 'harlot' in questioin was guilty of a man who left her after promising to take care of her. Wow. What would have happened if she was also pregnant? Would they also have done so if she were pregnant? Why yes. If you look further in the bible you will find situations where Gods priests said that He orderd his people to actually kill All pwople in certain circomstances including porregnant women and infants. Humm, do you believe in the word exactly as it is written? If so you do actually follow Gods ways. He himself 'spotainiously' abourts fetuses all the time. These rightious people also do not want 9 year old girls who will die to get medical help even if the infant i alredy dead. Truley NOT Godly and no filled with the compassion that Christ himself showed. Pathetic!
angela